Alice Cooper: His name alone instantly conjures up the stuff of rock and roll legend. Yet even after 50 years of hit albums, global mega-tours, guillotines, straitjackets, and did he or didn’t he rumors, the man who single-handedly invented “shock rock” remains as famous—or perhaps infamous—as ever.
Detroit Stories, Cooper’s latest album, is the icon’s biggest hit since 1973’s Billion Dollar Babies. It not only reunited Cooper with fabled producer Bob Ezrin, who’d helped give the original Alice Cooper Band its signature look and sound 50 years ago, it chalked up chart-topping positions around the world, and brought an apparently much-needed bit of hard rock—as well as good old-fashioned Detroit-style boogie—to Cooper’s legion of fans.
But Cooper, born Vincent Damon Furnier to an evangelist dad and homemaker mom in Detroit, Michigan, 73 years ago, is a notoriously complex guy. He’s written several no-holds-barred memoirs and books, recounting tales of debauchery with the likes of Jim Morrison and John Lennon, as well as Bible study and daily prayer, with stops for cameos in Wayne’s World 2 and The Muppet Show, plus a few rounds of golf with Donald Trump, along the way.
In a wide-ranging interview, Cooper recalls the early days of the Alice Cooper Band in Detroit, his distaste for politics, the status of his band with Johnny Depp, and more.
It’s got to be a kick for you sitting there in Arizona—not able to be on the road, which I know you love—getting these great reviews, with an album that’s selling like hotcakes.
It’s sweet. It debuted at No. 1, which scared us. I said, “What’s wrong with this world?” My last No. 1 was 48 years ago, when Billion Dollar Babies was No. 1. I mean, we had a lot of big albums, but they were never No. 1. I think that must be a record: 48 years between No. 1’s.
A lot of the records that have come out in the last six or eight months, certainly that were made during the pandemic, have had a softer side to them. This is one of the first albums that’s really rocked hard. Do you think that’s what people were looking for?
I think they were looking for it. And we see the light at the end of the tunnel now, too. Everybody’s getting their vaccinations, and everybody’s thinking, “We could actually be seeing live music by the middle of summer.” And that’s what I’m hoping, too. So, I do think this record came out at exactly the right time. Although we actually did the record pre-pandemic, we waited for the right time for it to come out. And the record company, Ear, they’re an old-school record company, doing all kinds of publicity stunts. They’re projecting me on the Eiffel Tower! All these insane things. I love it!
I’ve got to ask you, since, as you say, we’re seeing the light at the end of the tunnel: You said that you thought the next president would be even worse than Trump. It seems as though we’re doing OK this time around, with actual grown-ups running things, and that’s making a difference?
Well, first of all, 50 percent of the people are going to be against you the minute you become president. So, it was interesting to me that people thought, “Nobody’s ever going to be worse than Bush.” And then, we got Obama. And when Obama left office, he had a worse approval rating than Bush.
Well, that’s not actually true. Bush’s approval rating when he left office was, I think, around 35 percent. But Obama’s was in the mid-50s. And Clinton’s—this may surprise you—was around 65 percent.
But it’s the way the American people think. If you’re not doing exactly what everybody thinks you should do… It’s the most thankless job, I think, in the world, is being president. Who would want that job?
And yet, you ran for president.
Oh, yeah. I mean, totally satirically. In fact, I said that if anybody actually voted for me—if I ever became president—I would have had the whole country impeached.
I remember that. I’m not sure what that means, but it’s a great line.
I’m so truly unpolitical. John Lennon always used to try to get me involved in politics. “Use your voice, man.” And I’d just sit there and go, “John, you’re trying to save the world. I’m just trying to entertain them.”
Well, he had already done that. He had moved on from that. You know, during the pandemic, a lot of people have spent time at home with their families, discovering or rediscovering old movies and TV, catching up on things like Wayne’s World, and now, on Disney+, The Muppet Show. I have to say, your appearance is one of my favorite episodes. But what do those sorts of appearances mean when you have such a long career? And also, do you think they’ve brought new fans to you, especially during the pandemic?
Oh, yeah. I think so. You know, a lot of kids would have only heard the legend of Alice Cooper. You know, these mythical characters, Alice Cooper and Ozzy, and all the insane people from back in the day. And now they’ve gotten to see me in The Muppet Show, and it’s so great! I’ll tell you, the Muppets was one of the most fun things I ever did in my life. When they first asked me to do that it was my favorite show, but I kept balking. I told them, “The problem is, I’ve built myself into this dark character, and I don’t want to water it down.” Eventually, I asked them, “Who else has done the show recently?” And they told me Christopher Lee and Vincent Price! I went, “I’m in! If those guys can do it, then I certainly can.” It was a whole week in London with Frank Oz and Jim Henson—all the original guys—and we had so much fun. I’m telling you, that show really went beyond all boundaries. You could put anybody on that show, and they would look good.
And Wayne’s World? Has that appearance had legs? Because lots of young people are just discovering that film?
Do you know how many times a day I hear, “We’re not worthy?” I mean, honestly, since 1989? If I go to an airport, everybody thinks no one has ever done that before. They go, “You ready?” “Yeah, OK.” Then they get down on their knees. “We’re not worthy!” And I go, “Oh, that’s clever. Nobody’s ever done that.” I don’t want to embarrass them, you know? “Oh yeah, that’s funny, yeah.”
You really honor your Detroit influences and roots on Detroit Stories. I hear Motown, but I also hear Suzi Quatro, I hear Mitch Ryder, I hear the MC5, I hear the Stooges. This isn’t a concept record, per se, though you are known for that, but you’re also known as a storyteller, so I wonder: Did you consciously draw on those inspirations to create that Detroit mood or did it just happen, given the subject matter and the players, who included the original Alice Cooper Band?
Sometimes, you listen to guys play, and you go, “Wow, what an interesting flavor that is.” So, when I got into the studio, since R&B is in the DNA of every Detroit player—I don’t care how hard rock they want to be—it swings and it has that groove. Normally, I would direct things away from that. “I don’t want any R&B on the record. This is a hard rock record.” Since it’s Detroit, though, I went, “I want all of that. I want that way in there. I don’t want to lose any of that.” And so that’s become the concept of this record, the fact that it was written in Detroit, recorded in Detroit, with all Detroit players. There’s your concept.
You’ve said that you were not aware, but I find it hard to believe that you didn’t realize that it’s been 50 years since Love it to Death and Killer and “I’m Eighteen.”
Everybody has to remind me about everything like that. I just don’t live in the past at all. Every day, somebody says, like, “It’s the 23rd anniversary of Zipper Catches Skin.” OK. I never would’ve known that. So, nobody had brought it up to me that Love it to Death was 50 years old. And what a coincidence that we were in Detroit, right where that album was written, doing another album. Because that was a real Alice Cooper album. The first two—for Frank Zappa’s label—were more songs that we had written before Alice had come into the picture, so to speak. Love it to Death was the true first Alice Cooper album, because Bob Ezrin—our producer then and now—gave us an identity. We’d never had a visual identity. We didn’t have a musical identity. He came in and said, “Why is it when you hear the Doors, you know it’s the Doors? Because they have such an identity.” He told us, “Ten hours a day, we’re going to rehearse.” And that’s what we did. For like, three months! We developed the Alice Cooper sound, and there it was. Love it to Death, when you heard that, you went, “Oh, that’s Alice Cooper.”
And that character was born, too.
That’s right.
By the time you were touring Love it to Death, you had become that persona. I know you compartmentalized it later, but were you living that character at that point?
Yeah, I didn’t really know where I began and where Alice ended. There was a real conflict of interest there, and I was drinking, and I was doing what all the boys did.
You were a Hollywood vampire.
[Laughs] But I was the only alcoholic in the band, though I didn’t really realize I was an alcoholic. I wasn’t drunk, necessarily, I was just always on a golden buzz. But everybody else could stop drinking while I just kept drinking. And that added to the confusion of who am I and who is he. So, when I got sober is when I really separated the two. Because I wanted Alice Cooper to be my favorite rock star. I get to play my favorite rock star. And he’s in the third person. I can talk about him. “Well, he shouldn’t wear that.” “Alice would never say that.” That way, I could walk away from Alice. I could leave Alice onstage. Because Alice doesn’t want to be in this world. He wants to be onstage, so let’s just leave him up there. And as soon as I would leave the stage, I was back to being myself, and I felt what freedom that was, of not having to carry that character around all the time.
I'm curious about the religious aspect of things. Your dad was a preacher, of course. But was your faith always there, or did that come to you in sobriety?
Well, it completed me. It was something that I had walked away from. I grew up in the church, and I’d moved away from it and then I came back to it, because it was something I was missing. I was missing my relationship with Jesus Christ, and to me, that was more important, really, than anything. My one-on-one relationship with Christ that was very, very important. And my wife—who plays Mademoiselle Guillotine, mind you—can lead a Bible study all day, and then scare you to death onstage as a murderer at night. So, it just goes to show you that you can be a rock star and a Christian.
There’s so much to unpack there, I don’t even know where to begin. It sounds like you’re born again. Is that how you identify?
Yeah. When they say born again, what it really means is that you’ve come back to your relationship with Christ. It really has nothing to do with church. Church is great if you find the right church and find a bunch of people that are like you. But people have this image that, “Oh, I’m Christian, I’m better than you.” That has nothing to do with my faith. In fact, if anything, it’s pointing to how much you’re not better than anybody. It’s the one-on-one relationship I’m looking for. You’ll get this: I think that George Harrison had that. George Harrison had a spiritual awakening in his life. And I did too. And to me, now, at 73, I’ve never been happier. I go to Bible study every Wednesday morning. I’ve never been more productive.
My question was, is that something that came to you alongside your sobriety and supported your sobriety, or did you find it prior to getting sober?
It was something that I’d avoided, but I knew deep down in my soul that I was avoiding it, and that I was really troubled. I knew I was in trouble, more than the alcoholism, only because that can be cured, so to speak. Me ignoring the Lord was something that had me thinking to myself, “I’ve got to get this together.” The only time I could get it together, though, was when I got sober. When I got sober, then I could see it clearly, and I could say, “I can do both. I can be a rock star. I can be Alice Cooper. My lifestyle, though, is not going to be the lifestyle that it used to be.”
It’s funny you would bring George Harrison up. He had a similarly thoughtful, intellectual vision of spirituality. I’m listening to you, and I’m thinking, a lot of people who call themselves Christian have defended Trump. If I have my facts correct, you’ve played golf with him, and you know him a little. How do you reconcile what this country has just been through?
Trump is just such an incredibly complex character. I mean, you know, Biden’s Christian, too. But when people say, “Well, you’re Republican, so…” I’m not actually Republican. I’m actually very in the middle. I’m a moderate. I try to find the good on both sides, and I think that’s the way to be. But if you’re Christian, and you’re homophobic, and you’re anti-this and anti-that, that’s just wrong. My view of Christianity is bigger than that.
Alice Cooper performs at the Fire Fight Australia, a concert for National Bushfire Relief, in Sydney on February 16, 2020.
Peter Parks/AFP/GettyThe last time we spoke was five or six years ago, with Joe Perry in New York, when you were promoting the Hollywood Vampires album.
Yes, and I just talked to those guys. They’re still writing. I think every musician who’s sitting around, they’ve all got a studio at home, and can’t tour, or do gigs, so what are you going to do? You’re going to write songs. But I love those guys. When we were making the first Vampires album, the whole idea was that this was an album paying tribute to all of our dead drunk friends. And everybody in the room was sober. I said, “Isn’t this weird? We’re all sober doing songs about our dead drunk friends.”
You’re survivors, if nothing else. You said a third Vampire’s album is in the works. How far into it are you?
Everybody’s just writing, still. I know Johnny [Depp] was writing all last year, when that whole thing was going on with him. But you know, that’s not going to stop him from going home and writing. In fact, it probably helped. I’m expecting some pretty interesting songs. And Joe put himself in Florida down there and kind of stayed there. And, of course, I’m in Phoenix, so it’ll be great when we all get together. You know, the crazy thing about that band is you’ve got eight guys in the band, and you’ve got three alpha males leading it, but there’s never been one argument. Nobody’s ever even raised their voice to anybody in that band. It’s really cool.
So, Johnny Depp is still in the band? With all the drama, you’re going to have him in the band?
There’s no drama. He said, “Hey, that’s another world. That has nothing to do with what I’m doing in the band.” He’s like, “I can’t wait to get back onstage.” He’s one of my best buddies. And he just made an album with Jeff Beck. For anybody that thinks Johnny’s not a guitar player, Johnny can play, man. When Joe got sick and couldn’t play in New York, actually, Johnny and Tommy Henriksen played all the leads. People were shocked. They just went, “What?!” They didn’t know he was that good.
